Character gender and you

[GarfunkeL]

Very ambitious project you have going on here, good luck with it!

I scanned the other question threads quickly but didn't find anything about this, so:

Are there any differences between male and female characters or are the differences purely cosmetic?

If there are differences, are these purely at character creation or are "maximum" stats also affected?

Is the world the standard "fantasy" world in that women can do any job that men can and vise versa? Or is there misogyny across the board? Or only in certain factions?

Thanks and keep up the good work!

[Windexglow]

Women will be featured in the expansion pack "Those dishes aren't washing themselves" :p

In all seriouness though, (I do not know this for certain) women will have altered stats, but be able to do the same jobs as men.

[Captain Deathbeard]

I don't plan to affect stats based on gender, but gameplay will. For one thing it will affect certain character relationships, and also there will be certain religious factions and cultures that discriminate based on gender and race, to various extents.

[GarfunkeL]

Ok, sounds good, thanks for the replies.

[RustKnight]

Chris you look like you want this game to be realistical, at least modify the starting stats on female and male... i won't call you a sexist if you do

[Hector]

I wouldn't change base stats based on gender, unless you happen to have separate stats for mental focus and for multitasking (frankly, I can't see that such a distinction would impact gameplay, thus it probably shouldn't be there). Physically, there are next to no differences which could impact gameplay (yes the average woman is physically weaker than the average man, but this is more due to upbringing than biology IMHO; if someone really wants to play a weak woman, they can always reduce their strength stat), so there's no point differentiating there either. Besides, it would be one hell of a large can of worms to open...

[RustKnight]

Probably your right, deep inside i find it annoying when they get diff starting stats.

[Lisianthus]

I think that the starting skills should be the same for both genders. But the dialogs should be different and there should be some stuff in the game that only males can do and some things only females can do. If they're exactly the same thing and get same dialogs etc you don't get the feeling that the world is dynamic and you get a feeling of "pre-scripted dialogs"

[Hector]

I believe that's what they had in mind, though I can't think of many things (seduction or gender based societies aside) that women can do and men can't, same as I can't think of many things men can do and women can't (aside from gender based societies, as mentioned above).

[RustKnight]

Only thing i am pointing out is that, firstly genetecly woman are born weaker (form strengh point of view) than men, but that doesn't mean they can't train from small as to grow as strong as any other men, only difference is that they will have to train longer and harder for that. Some games like mount and blade tend to put more agility points for women and less for men also more strengh for men and less for women.

[wazupwolf]

actully a man holds the fastest ever run record and a man holds the most ever lifted sooo hahahahah

[Hector]

Like I said; there's no need to bother differentiating; the average man is physically stronger than the average woman (using mean averages), but this is more likely to be nurture than nature, given that genetics don't just govern how you start but your potential as well.

[Captain Deathbeard]

Exactly, and the essence of the game is that you can aim to be whatever you want to be, without being restricted.

[Windexglow]

I wouldn't mind having a few areas where only males can get into, and likewise with females. From buildings/towns, to talk trees.

Likewise, males should be more inclined to follow a male leader, whereas females should be more inclined to follow a female leader.


Some things should be harder for the opposite sex, but not impossible.

[Hector]

Likewise, males should be more inclined to follow a male leader, whereas females should be more inclined to follow a female leader.

Might I suggest that that be more an individual thing than a gender based thing? After all, some women may well think that a man would make a better leader than a woman, or a man might decide that being led by a woman may be an interesting change of pace.

[wazupwolf]

thatd be one phyco dude

[Captain Deathbeard]

I wouldn't mind having a few areas where only males can get into, and likewise with females. From buildings/towns, to talk trees

There will be. There are a lot of prejudiced towns and factions in the game, so you may have situations where certain characters will attract trouble or have to stay behind entirely. This applies to race as well as gender.

[wazupwolf]

dang racists il pown em with my mighty bruce lee style

[Shoelip]

Um, where are people getting this idea that men and women have the exact same physical capabilities? I mean... it's definitely not from athletics where men constantly outclass women in most areas. Is it from scientific data? Is it just for the sake of being PC?

[yssarile]

sake of pc, lol

there are a lot of biological differences between the too. subtle, in obvious ones, sure, but they are there. and there are a sh*t ton of physiological differences. as a rule of thumb, men = strong physically, women = strong pysiologically

for instance, if you take a man, and a woman, and give them both no excercise, or exactly the same amount and type, along with diet, the man will have considerably more muscle mass

a woman will have to work considerably harder to reach the same level as a man, in nearly all cases. obviously this varies slightely from individual to individual but youd need the extremes of both to overturn that particular rule.

in terms of society, social aspects and life, men and women are equal, but they are not physically the same.

hell, even unchangably so, the skull is different. one of the best ways to tell the sex of a skeleton pre-advanced forensics was to look at the skull, the brow ridge is only present on men (the brow ridge alludes to the thick portion of the skull on the forehead). so in short, if you hit a guy in square in the middle of the forehead, its going to has less of an affect than on a girl.

i mean, if you think about it, even if after sexual diamorphism, they were identical at the start of human history, you have however long of the man being the one selected to fight, based on hormone driven primal instinct. so over that time you have slight changes due to that, if nothing else.

and even if we ignored biological fact, then we still have the fact that if you kick a man in the balls hes going down. so even pretending they are completely idnentical, there are relevent combat differences for a game.

however, having said all of that, i do agree that it has no business being in a game, to anything more than a mild extent. dialogue options, reaction of different people being affcted, yes, that is relevent the game world, but barring anything short of a medical simulation or virtual reality, its purely extra work for the developer getting the balancing right, plus its a game, while it might be realistic, its not going to be based on things working EXACTLY AS they would in the real world. otherwise you wouldent be out risking life and limb, youd be doing the past equivelent of your job now

now, in a vr simulation, it would be important, but in kenshi, it doesent really matter whether the developer includes slight changes between the two or not, since it makes hardly any practical difference. (though a 'kick in the balls' combat option would be hilarious) to actualy get anything approximating the actual average difference including variable tolerances, is more than just base stat tweaking, it would involve having entirely seperate skill developmental times, and all sorts of things which than varied for individuals, and for the tiny, miniscule difference it would actually have on the player, im sure everyone would rather the work went into other aspects of the game, lol. as to whether there is a very slight basic stat change, or they are left identical, i for one dont really mind either way