Camera Alterations & Tutorial Suggestions

[Crazybuddha56]

Hi! So I just tried your game out now and so far, I think its really interesting and I am looking forward to seeing in progress. A couple of things jumped out at me right away that I think could help the game.

The main thing that I thought of first was the camera could use some work. I'm sure its far from finished, but I have a few suggestions about how it might be made better.

Firstly, a button or mode that lets the camera automatically center and follow on your selected character(s) would be really helpful in long travel so the player does not need to keep scrolling to keep up with whomever is moving

Secondly, I would love to see an alternate camera mode that not only follows the selected character but also mimics 3rd Person action games. Think of how Dragon Age: Origins allowed the player to switch between an isometric(ish) mode that covered the whole party like Baulders Gate but then allowed the player to switch to a 3rd person over-the-shoulder mode where WASD moved the selected character. This mode was somewhat similar to how MMOs generally look.

Additionally, I have some ideas for a tutorial of sorts. I may have been mistaken, but the building you start in front of did not seem to have any trade goods for sale. It would be nice to provide some kind of cheap trade good there to introduce that gameplay mechanic to the player right away.

The same goes for combat. It would be helpful, I think, to force the player into an easy fight very early just so they can get used to how combat works in a safe(ish) situation. That way they know what to expect when real fights occur later.

These are what stuck out to me right away, let me know what you think you get a chance. Thanks!

[Tolwrath]

The first thing is already in the game. Try double-clicking or right clicking on a character's portrait (I forget which it is). This should cause the camera to center on and follow that character.

[1337]

Yes, right clicking will do it.

I like the way the game starts right now, if you are to naive, get into your first fight and get owned, that will make you grow more than through a bothersome "tutorial location".
The second time you start a game, you'll know better than attacking a band of bandits with a rusty sword and you'll maneuver them towards the guards.

[Crazybuddha56]

Oh, I guess the camera thing it is. Nevermind.

However I don't think that having one easy bandit would require a "tutorial area". I would simply be one quick fight at the beginning to give the player a sense of how the game works. Think of how Mount and Blade Warband starts, where you fight off a couple of bandits right away. Its technically a tutorial but doesn't feel like on.

But if that's still not your cup of tea, then perhaps an optional tutorial mode like the original mount and blade. Its completely optional, and only plays if you select it from the main menu

[1337]

I would simply be one quick fight at the beginning to give the player a sense of how the game works.

Problem is that the game doesn't work like that . If you get an easy first opponent, you'll just end up dying on your second encounter. The game is hardcore for sure, but that's how it's meant to be (like dwarf fortress for ex...) and i don't think chris wants to soften it to much just to appeal to more players (we already have to much of those games around ).

Anyway, there are already different starting scenarios, so a "beginner scenario" is feasible. But i still feel that you won't truly learn how harsh the world is until you get that first taste of death, makes you loose your naivety inherited from other games quite fast.

[Crazybuddha56]

I see you point, and for the most part I agree. I do like the fact that the game is hard, but I feel as though there is a way to balance that and the need to understand how to play and maintain the games challenge, because that is one of the games best features. I don't mind losing, but I would prefer it to be because I lack the skill to play, not "I don't know what I'm doing oh god I'm dead now".

A separate mode reachable from the main menu with some in-depth tutorial would be more then enough.

[1337]

As an optional modus in the main menu i don't see the harm, as long as I'm not forced to play through a tutorial (even if just to kill a single weakling).
But I still believe that getting your ass handed to you after 2min in your first game will teach you more about the game than what a conventional tutorial can convey in 30min of weakish playing and tons of text

I don't mind losing, but I would prefer it to be because I lack the skill to play, not "I don't know what I'm doing oh god I'm dead now".

More like: "I'm attacking 5 bandits with a rusty sword and pants oh god I'm dead now... why??? it worked in skyrim"

[Tolwrath]

Problem is that the game doesn't work like that . If you get an easy first opponent, you'll just end up dying on your second encounter.

This is one of the things I really love about the game, and I have a feeling it just sort of happened without Chris even trying to make this message. But basically one of the first things to happen to EVERY player of this game is to have one guy run out and attack a group of bandits, only to die, or be severely crippled. At this moment, the player is forced into realizing "I just sent one untrained, unexperienced, below average guy to fight an entire group of bandits, and expected to win... goddamn I feel retarded."

It's just so awesome how it so quickly breaks the player's idea of balance that had been taught to them by other games, and makes them realize that their previous expectations of balance were just outright silly.