Concerned and need reassuring with progress

[XtraCrispy]

Hi. I am a fan generally concerned with the progress of Kenshi. I bought the game when it was first made available for purchase and it has come a long way, However, the past 6 months or so it seems like very few small features have been released in the experimental builds. I understand the dev team is likely a very small group with limited capacity. I do wish this game to succeed because I like was has been done so far. I am just worried that many features mentioned are not done and even more new ones are being talked about, such as the introduction of animals, when archery and other features are still missing. Is there an estimated date for the official release? I checked the road map and posts but there are no milestones. Having worked in the software development industry, no due dates can lead to things never getting finished.

I've been burned before by games going unfinished for years without any deadline and I don't want this game to go that way. Hope this doesn't come across as inflammatory as it is not meant that way.

[Hatsune_Neko]

Progress update
Steam Announcement of Progress

No due dates is the Devs decision, this is so he can take his time finishing the game and not be rushed to meet an expected deadline that might not be possible to fulfill.

[Koomatzu]

Sorry! My fault for neglecting the Lo-Fi forums!
Please read the links that Hatsune mentioned, hopefully that will answer your questions.

Hatsune has it spot on. We also prefer not to give dates too early on because we don't want to mess people around with delays. Which of course is always highly possible in game development

[Butta]

Sorry! My fault for neglecting the Lo-Fi forums!

What a great community manager!

[Koomatzu]

What a great community manager!

[dietpills42]

Progress update
Steam Announcement of Progress

No due dates is the Devs decision, this is so he can take his time finishing the game and not be rushed to meet an expected deadline that might not be possible to fulfill.

Kind of unprofessional not to set deadlines. But then again after seeing what deadlines can do to games like Call of Cthulhu (you have to rely on saving frenetically in order to overcome the bugs), or after watching shit rain forever in Project Zomboid`s forums due to a few busted deadlines, I`m beggining to think deadlines aren`t really good when it comes to indie game developers, specially since it`s such an open and delicate kind of biz.

[Hatsune_Neko]

Kind of unprofessional not to set deadlines.

It can be but it depends on the business and company. the larger the company, the more of a need for them, but the smaller ones can take there time.
The Devs kinda sorta set a deadline for the upcoming patch. and when it didn't come out when they thought it would, we had a bunch of disappointed and doubtful people on the steam forums. and then used it to beat the topic to death.

Setting one for a company the size of Lo-Fi Games isn't all that practical. especially since it's their first game.

[BigD145]

Progress update
Steam Announcement of Progress

No due dates is the Devs decision, this is so he can take his time finishing the game and not be rushed to meet an expected deadline that might not be possible to fulfill.

Kind of unprofessional not to set deadlines. But then again after seeing what deadlines can do to games like Call of Cthulhu (you have to rely on saving frenetically in order to overcome the bugs), or after watching shit rain forever in Project Zomboid`s forums due to a few busted deadlines, I`m beggining to think deadlines aren`t really good when it comes to indie game developers, specially since it`s such an open and delicate kind of biz.

A lot of studios that do set deadlines end up with a shoddy product that needs months of patching after release. This includes AAA producers.

[dietpills42]

That`s why I mentioned Zomboid, a game by a really community active Indie dev called Indie Stone. the outburst of rage that went on in the forums due to a few busted deadlines really demotivated the devs, and we all know how morale is important in any kind of business. Some forum users were even accusing the devs of spending too much time on their personal blogs, it was great. Now they don`t set deadlines anymore.

That`s why I mentioned Call of Cthulhu, a game by an AAA company, Bethesda. The game came out so bugged for the PC version, that it`s still unplayable unless you use mods, and it`d be a really fun game too if it didn`t crash every 20 minutes and had invisible main quest items so much.

Did you guys even read the whole post? Or just the first phrase?

Internally, I think deadlines are still essential to keep things running, but it`s not something you really want to talk about with the public, it might not make much for company transparency but things are different when your main media of distribution`s target market is filled with teenagers whose impulsive opinions actually do matter A LOT, specially now, since Steam released the whole curator and reviews thing. Just one slip up and your game can be as good as dead in Steam, or maybe bad publicity will actually attract more people, who knows, the average gamer may not even care about the steam user ratings or Metacritic, but then again do you guys remember a game called Infestation: Survivor Stories? Yeah, me neither. Let`s just see what happens to Starforge and Spacebase DF-9 in a few months, both of them have really low ratings on Steam, Starforge really earned theirs, but Spacebase might have some fight left in it.

[Hatsune_Neko]

we read it. the entire thing.

but yea on starforge. that game is pretty much dead in the water after they rushed it out after running out of funding. the other one, don't know, i don't have it so couldnt say.

But if they do have deadlines. it would most likely be internal. to prevent backlash from the community for not meeting one thats set. The community can be very fickle. ( for any game forum realy )

[Dorrin]

The community can be very fickle.

This is why we can't have nice things. Like pitchforks and flaming torches.

[Bancheis]

Honestly, I have no problem with them not having deadlines. What I would like to see though is an update to the experimental version of the game at least, so we can see the progress ourselves. It's been 4 months since any of the files have received an update. Kind of forced me to put this game back on the shelf and move on to other things. It's hard not to burn out on early access games, but even harder if there is a severe lack of content update for the test/experimental/alpha/beta/etc versions.

[Hatsune_Neko]

the lack of updates is frustrating but thats because of what they are working on.

As for burning out yea. myself i changed over to a few other games for the moment as i wait for the next upcoming update. and the question of merging the Alpha beta test build with the normal Alpha build has been asked before. but it still has a bad CTD with the new wall segments. so that might be why it hasn't been added yet.

[RighteousSinner]

This haitus honestly reminds me of when the game first came out. We'd get an update every 5-6 months or so while Chris was busy making money elsewhere so he doesn't starve.

We'll get an update before we all die of old age, rest assured.

In the mean time I'll be over at the From the Depths forum making epic looking constructions of destruction and mayhem.

[McDerp]

The main page at lofigames.com has a nice little dev-blog entry that deals with the game completion situation.

Are you at all familiar with Starbound, OP? The game developed by one of the Terraria devs, who made about $5mil through beta sales, then proceeded to hire a new office worth of people, move them across from one side of the globe to another, all to have them work on new games.

Chucklefish currently has 8 (last i checked) titles under their name, with Starbound not having been updated in almost a year. How's that for some development perspective? Imagine if Kenshi made a hugs splash on announcement, made five million from pre-orders, and hadn't updated aside from a hotfix on release, then Lo-Fi proceeds to make another 8 irrelevant and quite frankly, appalling games. (The "smart business move" argument is irrelevant here and a topic for another thread, we're talking from a perspective of someone being owed something they payed for.)

Tl:DR; This isn't Chucklefish, the devs of Starbound that have made $5mil and wasted most of it on making new bad games without completing the original. This is Chris Hunt-yo-face, livin the ramen lyfe, paying cool coders like Olly to help continue finishing the game. But Lo-Fi don't got no $5mil like chucklefish do to burn, so give them time to finish.

It'll be glorious.

[Sooner535]

I would disagree with you on that, development on SB has never stopped. In fact the nightly build is literally updated almost nightly lol they have changed almost the entire game making it progressive and enjoyable. SB is by far not finished but it is by far not abandoned

[McDerp]

I never explicitly said that Starbound's development has ceased. It's merely way slower than that which would be expected from a multi-million dollar company. They took their earnings and stuffed them in sub-par games, 9 of them to be precise. None of this has been witnessed here, and aside from the millions of dollars, i guess that's a very good thing!

But seriously. Other than the new tutorial missions and some more fine tuned world-gen, what's changed since December 2013?

If you've been playing nightlies like me, you'll notice that content shifts in and out as well. For one, the other day repairing pickaxes was not working. Add me on steam if you wanna play together! you can find me with the same name and pic


Kenshi could take another 5 years to complete for all i know, Chris hasn't made multiple millions of dollars and isn't planning on making another game 'till Kenshi's done. Befittingly just actions to contrast the air-headedness Chucklefish exhumes.

Fear not, Kenshi is not like other indie titles. Let it be known however, anybody who is sceptical does have the right to be so, I aint judging as these kinds of suspicions are well founded based on the current indie gaming climate. Then again AAA publishers ramp up their trollbot propaganda armies during the pre-holiday season.

[Mattk50]

Chris has expressed a determination to finish this game come hell or high water, but i just hope he hasn't overextended Lo-Fi games too much. I've seen it happen many times, a game developer expands too fast due to business inexperience then can't support itself and crashes back down, bringing the game with it. It may be happening with star citizen, but luckily for them it looks like the money continues to roll in en masse.

[McDerp]

Chris has expressed a determination to finish this game come hell or high water, but i just hope he hasn't overextended Lo-Fi games too much. I've seen it happen many times, a game developer expands too fast due to business inexperience then can't support itself and crashes back down, bringing the game with it. It may be happening with star citizen, but luckily for them it looks like the money continues to roll in en masse.

everything *seems* to be in order, and from what little i've learned from snooping around, the financials for Lo-Fi are structured so there is minimum worst case scenario another year of development with *NO* income. I don't know sales specifics and i'd like to not know them if that makes sense, so if i'm wrong, it's indeed my fault for not wanting to verify what i think i know.

[philthymcnasty]

This dev has done a great job keeping people informed.

Furthermore, he has also kept things very small. I have seen a lot of Early access titles ruined because they ran out of money by expanding too quickly.

Keep in mind that this game has been in development for years now. This is a personal project for the dev, and i feel that he will not abandon it.

Honestly, with a completed pathfinding system, a person can have lots of fun with the current game. But they are adding a butt load of other things, like new biomes, new research, mobs, and many many more things.

So i will prepare for the next update, and play other games till then. That big sale over at GOG got me enough to keep me busy for a while.